b

A B CD: a conversation with b
Rob Whitehead, Bill Fairhall, Matt Grey

b work with both installation and performance, combining composed and improvisational elements that use electronic and electro-acoustic production and presentation, as well as found sounds and site-specific sound sources.

In performance the sound, lighting, projection, and sculptural elements challenge the conventional audience/performer relationship through sound diffusion, the distribution of the various machines and unique instruments, their configuration and physical layout within the space.

Brighton June 2002

This conversation took place in Brighton, England, on a beautiful summer's evening in June 2002, and is a transcript of b talking about their most recent work - a b cd. Ironically, RW was experiencing extreme hearing difficulties during the conversation ...

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BF: how about a bit of history?

MG: well, it all started with The Clear Collective really didn't it?

RW: about three years ago ...

BF: Let's see, what was that about? (laughs) Well, we were referred to as 'illbient flashgun technicians' once! (more laughs) It was the three of us plus two others, with a definite emphasis on live performance and improvisation. We were using a mixture of live site-specific 'instruments' like the street amplified through a drainpipe and other 'found sounds' discovered at the time and place of wherever we were playing.

RW: that drainpipe is certainly one sound which continues ...

BF: yes, combined with pre-recorded 'live' sounds, electronics, old synthesisers, live vocals on a couple of occasions, and conventional instrumental improvisation.

RW: let's talk about how we came to music, how we ended up doing this as opposed to something else.

BF: well the reason I've ended up doing this as opposed to any other kind of music is partly due to an impatience with learning traditional instrumental techniques, a growing interest in constructing sound-making objects from scratch, and developing the sound in the making process, and discovering what techniques are required to play the thing, in tandem with using found objects as the basis for new instruments, and through that discovering that I was getting as much absorption and fascination from the process, not to mention emotional enjoyment, listening to sound as music, as I might do listening to more conventional 'music'. In other words I was becoming aware of 'the music that's all around' ... other than the stuff that we make as musicians. With that I started realising a way to build compositions from found sound and home-made instruments simply to try and make them work as music. Why is this sound with that sound better than this sound with another sound?

MG: Would you say that there's something of the alchemist in your approach - combining one substance with another substance simply to see what happens?

BF: Well. We've certainly all had various kinds of formal musical education and that feeds into it. But yes, there is undoubtedly a certain amount of empirical alchemy about what we do. Yes, and perhaps in the same way that DJ's are looking to make a 'flow' for dancers, we're looking to make a 'flow' for listeners. Something that takes them on a bit of a journey. But maybe the same could be said for any live improvising composers.

MG: I was going to ask you more about composition, because for me it seems to be more about revealing composition through making. Perhaps in the way that a chef might work with the vegetables in a kitchen (laughs) ... researching, exploring, concocting new dishes ...

BF: and some things that might sound like research on first listening turn out to be, after repeated listenings, perfectly formed tasty compositions!

RW: a lot of it is about the interaction between the group, and that's the important thing about composition for me. It's all about the personal relationship between us and the sounds that we each have for any given piece. And the interaction between these elements is what makes it happen. And it's also why I prefer to work with other people rather than solo. Because it's the element of surprise that I like.

MG: It's probably worth mentioning the type of sounds we use, and the interest in quiet sounds, as well as sounds that are the extreme ends of the sonic spectrum. There's also the sculptural qualities of some of the sounds we use.

BF: I'd also like to emphasise the way that even in a recording environment I like to contribute a sense of performance, instruments that have presence, objects that are seen as well as heard. Instruments whose visual appearance contributes to the experience of listening to their sound are definitely part of my philosophy that the way an instrument is made and the sound it produces should be related.

RW: There's also the thing that if one person decides to take a role, perhaps at one end of the spectrum, then the others immediately form themselves around that ...

MG: or work in counterpoint to it ...

BF: a bit like the England team after a few injuries (chuckles) ... and certainly none of us want to be limited. We are all free at any time to produce any sound we want, and that's without any feeling of prior restriction to one instrument or tone colour, or any one compositional role, even if we do tend towards taking complementary positions in the music, the idea that we can take on any role at any time is an important one.

RW: going back to the type of sounds that we use, it's fair to say that perhaps, unlike many other bands, we don't concentrate on any one particular source - we're generating them ourselves, we're finding them on field trips, we're using traditional instruments as well as non-traditional instruments ...

MG: ... eclectic ...

RW: yes, that horrible word!

BF: yes, a sound is much more likely to be taken for its sonic quality rather than any other kind of significance. The significance emerges through composition. We don't do a recording of a Portuguese church marching band simply because it's a Portuguese church marching band. (laughs) ... it has to fulfil a certain sonic criteria.

RW: and largely the sounds we do use are things we've experienced ourselves ... We've actually gone out there and got it. And I wouldn't want to be using a house sample of a Portuguese church marching band (laughs) if I hadn't gone and got it myself.

MG: so you could say that there's a parallel there with photography in that it's a snapshot of a moment in time, and these sounds will inevitably have multiple layers of rich associations and meanings for the listener. It also seems to me that despite there being many random elements within the sounds that we use, we do produce something that sounds like carefully considered music, definitely drawing from music concrète, and these pieces are not simply the result of 'happy accidents'. The sound of the group has developed into something that has a signature, and a recognisably unique acoustic sensibility.

RW: A lot of the work is a result of us having developed the personal relationship with each other over the past few years. And although there's not necessarily a progression in the tracks on the album, there is a progression in the way we've made the music. And of course we've brought many things through from our work as The Clear Collective. And we all bring our baggage with us, like in any relationship! (laughs)

BF: The similarity that it does have with a conventional music group is that whatever sound sources we have chosen to use for a particular piece, and some of those sound sources arise out of the room where we happen to be recording the piece, we are not relying on any external control to mix the sounds together, we're mixing them live, by choosing what we perform and when ...

RW: ... a lot of our restrictions are self-imposed though ...

BF: ... partly technically and partly creatively ...

RW: ... it's going to be interesting to see what happens next (smiles) ...

BF: ... yes, this is definitely Phase One ... we're making work, but very much collecting ingredients and new techniques without introducing too much complexity just yet ...

RW: I don't feel there's any need for collective complexity, but more of a need for self-justification on a philosophical level, or it can feel a bit like just 'noodling' ... (laughs)

MG: one day's noodling can turn out to be the next day's perfect composition though. We discover the structure almost in hindsight sometimes ...

BF: ... yes, it's often retrospective discovery ...

MG: the images and associations that arise out of listening certainly evolve the more time you spend with the music, and that's inspiring. It's what pushes us on ...

BF: yes, we all need to be able to trust the process enough to switch off the absolute necessity for too much pre-meditated design. And for me, it's been quite liberating to be able to step back from all that, and learn to just trust your ears as you go along ...

MG: do you feel there is any comparison to be made with, say, the chance-based music of someone like John Cage ... although he used systems, and that's not something we've done as yet ...

BF: Perhaps our systems just have a more conscious kind of personality than Cage (laughs)

MG: Perhaps his was more of an intellectual approach ... The b music is quite intuitive, probably closer to free jazz.

BF: Whatever the sound source, however regular or periodic it is, there is always an organic quality to the sounds which has turned out to be quite a theme.

RW: Some people have said that we sound very urban though.

BF: That's probably because we use sounds like traffic passing, and the way we often maintain a lot of tension through very slowly building structures, then dissolution and re-building, often without much release for long periods. All that could contribute to a perception of it being an urban kind of music ...

RW: There's not so much philosophy going on in the music, it's something that just arises out of the intuitive making of the music, and I like that aspect of it, it's refreshing that we're not pushing any particular overt philosophy. Think about it afterwards and then place some kind of context on it if you must! (laughs)

MG: Is it like abstract painting? Or could it be minimalist? (laughs) Which school are we coming from? (laughs)

RW: It's three painters at odds with each other, somehow making it work together! (laughs)

BF: Finding a voice for yourself in the moment, making it work with what's going on around you ... Generally speaking we do take three distinct voices, and are looking to do that, as opposed to, say, making harmonies off the first voice we hear.

MG: A lot of the feedback has been along the lines of describing it as soundscapes, or music for installations, or even some kind of film music - that there's an imaginary visual universe that's being generated through the sound. Not unlike the Fourth World concept of Jon Hassell, or the imaginary culture of Alejandro Viñao.

RW: The other thing I've been hearing is that even the people who are not sure about it as 'music', have suggested that it could be used as music for people who are hard of hearing, people with learning difficulties, even as music for children ... Not that I'm quite sure why children are always mentioned! (laughs) Perhaps it's the use of extreme frequencies ...

MG: Having worked with deaf people, they often do respond to the feeling of the music through the frequency or the vibration, and that physical sensation is an interesting thing to work with. And there are specific ways to generate physical responses through sound - we will have to explore this further ...

BF: It is something that you can teach yourself, in that you can learn to perceive sound through feeling it as a sensation in the body. Deaf people are naturally closer to this. Hmm ... But going back to the sound sources - at the time we generate the sounds, there's no attempt to make a sound overtly musical, the sound becomes musical during its performance. Simon Jeffes of Penguin Café Orchestra has talked of personal epiphanies hearing planes flying overhead, and engine notes mixing, droning and producing all sorts of interesting beats - feeling as intense a musical satisfaction from that as from any composition.

MG: Not to mention the acoustic ecologists ...

BF: yes, Hildegard Westerkamp ... Well, we do use things like passing (tropical) rain showers, the sound of the San Francisco cable cars etc. And there's the almost periodic rhythms of the strobes, the percussive solos of rainfall on the windowsill, and the random nature of passing traffic ... these all get interpreted in a musical way.

MG: And our field recordings from our various trips around the world do have a certain freshness, just because when you're in a new place you're hearing things literally for the first time.

BF: I wanted to mention that on the one hand it is Deep Listening Music, and it can also be Aural Wallpaper in a more casual way, but there is enough depth there to reward intense listening. And in performance the music is not presented in a conventional musical setting in that we use the whole of the space, use sounds within the space, place the audience in unusual settings, and try and involve them in the sound in as active a way as possible.

RW: are you conscious of an audience?

BF: well, we get all sorts of people coming to the gigs - people who are often not collectors of sounds themselves, they just pop along to a local event, and get drawn in and are hopefully pleasantly surprised by their own capacity to get satisfaction from something they might never have expected to.

RW: I'm never thinking about the audience - either when creating or performing really - the audience are not an incentive as such.

BF: It wouldn't satisfy any of us simply to present documented work to a live audience though. And personally, I find the traditional concert hall is just not a satisfying way to present sonic work. Neither is the art gallery space. But both offer possibilities for us in the way that we choose to present the music.

RW: But the ultimate aim is to get an emotional response or even reaction from whoever is listening. So it makes no difference on that level. As long as we all feel comfortable! (laughs)

BF: (laughs) ... yes, sometimes we like to invite people in to our sound world, and sometimes we like to insist, whether they like it or not! (laughs) But we can and do manipulate the environment to maximise their emotional involvement. The theatre of live performance is such that it's always engaging even simply watching three people manipulating their instruments! But, you know, it's hard to be an axe-hero with a pile of junk and pick-ups! (laughs) And I just have to state an interest in the extension in the source of sound within a performance environment, beyond just a pair of loudspeakers - to utilise the space more thoroughly by means of sculptural instruments, the spatial arrangement of performers and equipment, and the use of pick-ups and transducers to amplify small sounds, hidden sounds, found sounds.

RW: And this approach will inevitably encourage some and discourage others from coming to one of our gigs - we just have to remain flexible in the way we create both the music and the performances.

BF: and there's no doubt in terms of what's going on at the moment, through the experiments coming out of dance culture, and the general advance of technology, that people have ears for a greater breadth of sonic material.

MG: Stockhausen said that 'the audience evolves too' ...

BF: It's that you can become personally involved with sound anywhere, anytime, anyplace ...

RW: There's a movement this way - people like Bernhard Günter and Thomas Köner - in a similar kind of vein, although in a very different style ...

BF: ... yes, there seems to be a trend for minimal electronic composition, especially with emphasis on the absences as well as the presences. Except that we have an improvising relationship, which is a difference with others who are working in similar sonic territories. And it does seem to give the music a certain organic and unpredictable quality.

MG: Since we're running out of time now, perhaps we should explain why b ...

BF: The only satisfactory explanation is that it was only by reduction were we likely to succeed! ... (laughs) Anything more complex had too many diverse interpretations and associations to make any sense - all the words had become so loaded with meaning that we had no choice but to reduce ... ad absurdum ... to a single character! (laughs)

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A B CD (2002)
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Rob Whitehead, Bill Fairhall, Matt Grey

01 a | 4838 kB 5:10
02 b | 5418 kB 5:47
03 c | 6783 kB 7:14
04 d | 7896 kB 8:25
05 e | 8252 kB 8:48
06 f | 9367 kB 9:59
07 g | 11614 kB 12:23

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SEPT 2002: To celebrate the release of 'a b cd', b performed at the Sallis Benney Theatre in Brighton, UK on Friday 6th September 2002 ...

DEC 2002: Asaurus Records kindly included one of the tracks from 'a b cd' on their compilation 'Finally Something To Replace Bowling', which is for sale at the stupendously cheap price of $5 ...

Asaurus Records 02 Dec 2002 / lo-fi, indie pop, & quiet experimental
http://asaurus.bandcamp.com/album/finally-something-to-replace-bowling

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Biographies

RW r(vis), making noise, hung out with various post-punk and electro-acoustic bands in the north of England during the 80's (Chumbawumba, Zoviet*France). He slowly moved to the South of England and in 1996 co-founded The Clear Collective with the other members of b, who went on to record and perform with a variety of musicians including Squarepusher. The Clear Collective were also commissioned to produce a soundtrack for German performance artist CiCi Blumstein's film Bag O' Bones, shown at film festivals throughout Europe. His recent work challenges conventional ideological notions of musical notation and structure, dealing with the extreme limits of aural perception.

RW r(vis): randomattention at gmail.com

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MG is a composer who has been producing sound and music for multimedia, dance and film since 1985. Previous work has included music for the butoh dancer Masaki Iwana's The Secret Agreement with Matter (Busshitsu tono Mitsuyaku) (1996), premiered at The Transmutations Festival of Live Art, The Zap Club in Brighton; CreateCell (1998), an interactive 3D environment based on a simple artificial-life model, shown at the disused Aldwych Tube Station in London; PauseForBreath (1998), an immersive and interactive installation that used large-scale projections and sound shown as part of the LoveBytes International Digital Arts Festival in Nottingham; sound design for an award-winning educational CD-Rom for BBC Geography about the Brazilian Yanomani tribe (1999); sound design for the Emersion series of games for Playstation (2000), and the soundtrack to the dance film Dreadnought Wharf (2001) by French choreographer Dominique Rivoal, shown at Chisenhale Dance Space in London.

His recent collaborations with Testcard include the soundtrack to the original 1922 'Nosferatu' by F.W. Murnau, The Voice Phenomenon Project, The Feature Creature shown at Tate Modern, and Transmit shown in Kyiv, Ukraine. He has also worked as a session musician playing all kinds of clarinets and flutes for people like Soname Yangchen, and Wevie Stonder ...

MG: heymattgrey at gmail.com

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BF comes from a diverse performance background, including recordings with experimental rock band Erick between 1988-92, culminating in the CD Estranged, and airplay on Radio 1. A burgeoning interest in sound sculpture and sound art led to collaboration with radical pyrotechnic performance artists Bow Gamelan, Ann Bean and Paul Burwell - and large site-specific performances including Zero Degrees, On the Thames at Greenwich, and the inaugaural event of LIFT on the roof of Bankside Power Station (1992).

He went on to develop large-scale outdoor performances as both a technician and performer, including On Air (1995) - a site-specific sound environment using live bees and radio diffusion. A founder member of The Clear Collective, his work has encompassed sound production for numerous projects including multimedia vocal group Chandalay Quor, and a garden sound sculpture for a special needs school in Portslade, Sussex. His recent work for innovative aerial theatre company The Dream Engine as both a technician and designer has taken him all over the world.

His concerns centre around the relationship between the means of sound production and audience, revealing a transparent technology and the sonic reality of the electro-mechanical mechanism. His work aspires to patrol the very borders of contemporary definitions of sound and music ...

BF: bill.fairhall at ic24.net

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